Hull repair. too flip or not too flip

TreelineIII · Post by **TreelineIII** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 10:45 am

This is a 18'6" Cruiser 1958. I have taken out all of the seats, engine well, and windshield. My concern is that I will need to replace a good portion of the keel, as well as a portion of the plywood bottom of the hull back by the transom. The boat is currently on the trailer. I am looking for suggestions as to how I access the area I need to work on. As it sits on the trailer I am not able to get too it. Do I need to flip, and if so how? Or can I do it upright, and in that case how do I lift it off the trailer. I am just working in my garage and have little / no acess to lifting equipment. I welcome any thoughts.

mengelmar · Post by **mengelmar** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 2:56 pm

I recently rolled my own restoration project (a '62 Sea Lancer) using nothing more than four friends, a couple of tires, and some wood blocking. We just slid her off the trailer and set the stern on two tires, you can also tie the boat in place while pulling the trailer ahead very slowly and carefully. Then we rolled her over onto her deck and alternately lifted bow and stern while adding blocking in several places to level her and provide good support. Before taking her off the trailer I added two 2x8 lateral braces evenly spaced between the transom and the first deck beam to keep the gunwales from pushing in or out during the roll. I also screwed 1x3 strapping in an "x" shape from the covering boards at the stern to the foredeck to keep everything the right shape. I stripped the hull outside and then blocked her up and put her back on the trailer upside down so I can finish filling and fairing back in the garage before painting.

john · Post by **john** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 5:04 pm

Very close to what I did with my Cruisers 202.

Bottom side up is the best way to work on bottom.

jim · Post by **jim** » Tue Apr 25, 2006 6:24 pm

I just recently flipped my 1958 Sea Lancer using the method described in the book "how to restore your wooden runabout", by Danenberg. I got just about everything I needed on E-bay. Instead of a pipe I used a 2x6 with 4 pillow block bearings with two short pipes in between each pair mounted on top of the 2x6. I ran tow straps over each "axle" and around the boat. All of this was suspended from two beams in my garage using two block and tackles. A third block and tackle went to a line that was wrapped around the boat. I lifted the whole thing with the two block and takles, getting the boat off the trailer. I moved out the trailer and then used the third block and tackle to flip the boat over. I then lowered it onto a stand I made to hold the boat. I did all of this pretty much by myself.
Jim

a j r · Post by **a j r** » Wed Apr 26, 2006 3:56 am

A 12 pack of beer and four or five guys manhandling the boat to roll it over is easiest. Bracing is important to make certain the hull shape is not goofed up. It's as easy as pie.

Are you aware that there are two seperate keels - an inner and outer one? The outer keel is screwed from below up thru the planking and into the inner keelson. There probably are a couple of carriage bolts near the junction with the stem.

Andreas

TreelineIII · Post by **TreelineIII** » Wed Apr 26, 2006 5:36 am

You all make it sound so easy. I wish a few of you were in town, are you?

I have to say that when I recently swithched trailers by floating it off and on, I was surprised how light it was. I will take this insight under advisement and try to round up a few friends. As for the Keel, yes I am aware of the design. Regarding the keel on the inside, I might have a problem finding white oak at full length($). Would I still be able to maintain the stregth if I relpaed it with shorter pieces with an alternating but joint. So I would likely have two pieces for each one that I am replacing. Keep in mind there is the primary keel and then the outer boards on either side. I would then bolt them all together again as before. I hope this question makes sense. Thank you all.

mengelmar · Post by **mengelmar** » Wed Apr 26, 2006 2:03 pm

TreelineIII wrote:I wish a few of you were in town, are you?

Could be? I'm in Maine

a j r · Post by **a j r** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 3:45 am

To make full length boards, use glued scarf joints. Cut a bevel on the ends of the boards at about an 8:1 or even better 12:1 ratio. Use a waterproof adhesive such as resorcinol. Cut and glue the boards into their full length prior to installing them into the keel assembly.

Andreas

TreelineIII · Post by **TreelineIII** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 4:34 am

Maine, I wish I was in your town. No, I am in Chicago. I will likely try the sarf idea, thanks.

JoeCB · Post by **JoeCB** » Thu Apr 27, 2006 4:29 pm

At the risk of complicating your decision process... here is another opinion. I completely replaced the entire keel assembly (( keel, keelson and cheeks (sisters ?)) as well as the majority of rib butt ends on my 57' Sea Lancer with the boat on it's trailer. And I did this without help. I submit that if you don't intend to remove / replace the garbord planks then 80% or the work is on the inside of the hull anyway. About the only thing to be done from outside ( on your back ) is fastening the keel piece thru to the keelson... and a few extra fasteners into ribs and cheeks. You may need to consider the compatability of your trailer design to this approach. To support the hull I slid two 4X4's between the trailer cross beams and the hull, directly under the stringers. This insured that the bottom stayed flat once the keel was cut out ( a very scary operation by the way!)
I did this work back in 2003 with good results. The boat has been used every year since in the Great Lakes and everything has remained in place. As I was doing the work I made several pages of notes and a couple of sketches, I would be happy to share these w/ you. Send me your e-mail address if you are interested.
Joe

TreelineIII · Post by **TreelineIII** » Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:44 am

Joe, I appreciate your comments. I am reluctant to try and flip this boat. For the simple fact that it is heavy, and difficult to manuver. I like the idea you have but do not clearly understand. Pictures and notes will help. My email is Eric_Platou@malloy.com I am tending to think I can do this on the trailer. The think is, is that I know I am in need of replacing the back two feet of the bottom plywood. But I still think this can be done using your approach. I look forward to your information.
Thanks
Eric

a j r · Post by **a j r** » Sat Apr 29, 2006 4:14 am

I flipped an 18 ft. Thompson with four people total. Took two minutes at most and was very simple. Did it in the driveway and public sidewalk with packing blankets and old carpet as cushioning.

The weight of your 1958 Cruisers, Inc. 18'-7" Vacationer is 880 pounds. Remove the windshield and if the seats and flooring are out, it's even lighter weight. No big deal to man handle a boat that size.

Andreas

Darrell Van Eck · Post by **Darrell Van Eck** » Wed May 03, 2006 8:58 am

Eric:

I also live in the Chicago area, 40 miles west. I purchased my wood for the keel from Owl hard woods in DesPlaines. They seem to have just about anything you would want, and open to the public.

I would recommend flipping the boat, I have a 62 Coaster that I just got back up right, it is not a big deal. It makes it much easier and faster to work on. I stripped the bottom and sides of mine complete, I can not imagine doing that on my back. It was bad enough doing it standing up.

I don't know where you are at in the Chicago area, but I would not mind showing you what I have done.

thompsondockside.com

Hull repair. too flip or not too flip

Hull repair. too flip or not too flip

flipping boat

Scarf 'em

Roll or not to roll ?